Reformatting Infinite Canvas Comics for print

[chrisSturhann]

Hi all,

I've got something of a delemma. I just posted a comic on my skateboarding site called Skategeezer

http://www.nosewheelie.com/griptales/1/index.html

Well, I just saw a post on a skateboarding bulletin board I follow from a friend, who publishes a print skateboarding magazine called The Concrete Wave. He wants to print it.

First, the story uses trails, and I think they add something to the story. I'd really like to retain them. It might even be cool to have them go through the magazine's gutter on facing pages. I guess my question is, is it feasible to use trails in a print comic, or should I go with a straight left to right, top to bottom, panel to panel print layout. I was thinking that it might be cool to treat facing pages, where possible, as one page with three rows (top, left to right), (middle, right to left), and (bottom, left to right). Of course, it might be a moot point if he tells me it would need to fit it all into 3 pages.

Second, I did the art on computer and made the mistake of doing it at 72 dpi. That in itself should not be that big of a deal, since it is at least partly vector based, and being able to rework some of the art would probably be a good thing. Some of the panels are just screaming to be reworked. But along those lines, if I kick up the resolution to 300 dpi (I think my computer would choke on anything higher), do I need to worry about antialiasing, or is that not an issue at print resolution.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks

Chris

[Wikkit]

I've got something of a delemma. I just posted a comic on my skateboarding site called Skategeezer

http://www.nosewheelie.com/griptales/1/index.html

Neato. I like the curly trails.

Well, I just saw a post on a skateboarding bulletin board I follow from a friend, who publishes a print skateboarding magazine called The Concrete Wave. He wants to print it.

Hey, congrats.

First, the story uses trails, and I think they add something to the story. I'd really like to retain them. It might even be cool to have them go through the magazine's gutter on facing pages. I guess my question is, is it feasible to use trails in a print comic, or should I go with a straight left to right, top to bottom, panel to panel print layout. I was thinking that it might be cool to treat facing pages, where possible, as one page with three rows (top, left to right), (middle, right to left), and (bottom, left to right). Of course, it might be a moot point if he tells me it would need to fit it all into 3 pages.

Making them go through the gutter would be impressive, as would making them turn the pages. Changing this comic from up to down to left to right might be interesting. I don't know if I'd use three solid rows, as the whitespace between the boxes adds something to the story. This space intentionally left blank, that sort of thing. To make the story go in the right order from page to page, you could make the story flow in a reversed S (left to right, right to left, left to right) as you say, or you could be extra brave and do it in a up and down squiggley (start at the top left, then down, then up, then down, etc).

Second, I did the art on computer and made the mistake of doing it at 72 dpi. That in itself should not be that big of a deal, since it is at least partly vector based, and being able to rework some of the art would probably be a good thing. Some of the panels are just screaming to be reworked. But along those lines, if I kick up the resolution to 300 dpi (I think my computer would choke on anything higher), do I need to worry about antialiasing, or is that not an issue at print resolution.

I wouldn't see it as a mistake. You couldn't have know it would need to be done higher, and doing it at 30 dpi takes more time.

I'm not an expert on image stuff, but I don't think antialiasing is necessary at higher resolutions. I think that's one of the reasons to use a higher resolution. You only get jaggies when you can see the individual pixels.

Ben

[InkAddict]

I've been through the resolution dilemmas with a friend of mine.

I'm not much of a web expert (though 72 dpi or pixels/inch is considered standard ... this may soon change due to the availability of broadband connections and better monitor screens), but I went through the complete print dilemma.

The human eye has a limit at about 300 dpi.

Things we easily recognise, even at small sizes, such as letters, may need 600dpi to 1200dpi to seem "crisp" though.

Print (computer printers, plotters, etc...) often can get you top notch 1200 dpi quality (though it makes for BIG files and expensive printing)

Press (REAL press, probably the way that skating mag is printed), is a lot less precise. 600 dpi will largely suffise (300 dpi ART won't get noticed as "pixeled", whereas 300 dpi letters sometimes are too "fuzzy" at small point sizes)

Anti-aliasing your image MAY help, but you won't need to if you're above the standards set above. If you first turn your vectorised art (Illustrator/Freehand/...) into PIXELISED art, you should make use of anti-aliasing, as it gives the IMPRESSION of a better and sharper picture. Try to keep the text Vectorbased when you can, though, 'cause that way your text can ALWAYS be set to the sharpest dpi-level possible! (a lot of export formats, such as Adobe Acrobat PDF let you chose different settings for the art and the lettering,... if you keep 'em seperated! That way you can print your images at 300 dpi --by large enough-- when your text can be printed at 600 or 1200 dpi, or in the case of press... infinite dpi --limited by the quality of the paper/print/... of course. Beware not to have pixel art mixed with vector art, though: it MAY result to differences in sharpness, that you'll only notice in print/press)

Good luck!

[chrisSturhann]

Ben,

Thanks for the comments. I printed it out yesterday. Just to get a feel for how it would layout into pages. In standard comic layout (no trails), it would go three pages. With trails, it would go four pages. Which way we go, will probably be determined by how tight his page budget is. I'd much rather go with the latter. We'll see.

Yingo,

Thanks for the lowdown on resolution. I've worked at a publisher for over ten years, but we've always left the printing technicalities in the hands of the printers. I've got a good grasp on the process, but not down to the nuts and bolts level.

Chris

[Kevin Pease]

Anti-aliasing should be avoided in print format. If you have a print-quality resolution, your lines will be sharp and smooth, but any grey pixels you have around the edges will only dirty them up, because grey has to be represented with screening dots which are much bigger than your pixels.

[gazorenzoku]

Yes, no anti-aliasing when working for print!! A high dpi will make anti-aliasing unnecessary, and also a pain in the *** in terms of file size and whatnot

(though this message might be ..... to late)

vince

[gazorenzoku]

This is a little bit off the original subject, but it is on the topic of turning an "infinite canvas" piece into a print piece...

A while ago I was thinking about making comic book scrolls. Other projects got in the way, so I still haven't done it yet, but one day I would like to try it out.

I suppose a printing company could work it so that the art gets printed right onto a scroll, but that would probably cost a lot of money. The closest thing I could come to that kind of thing was to print out the comic on a regular printer and paste the sheets on scroll paper. I found some scroll paper at a store here in Sapporo, but I don't know if other countries have this sort of thing available...

vince

[ragtag]

Depending on the printer, you may be able to feed the scroll directly into the printer. You might also need some special printer software, that won't divide your stuff into pages. But it should be doable.

A scroll comics would be very cool, and if the infinite canvas is not vertical, you could print it out as one big poster.

Ragnar

[gazorenzoku]

Depending on the printer, you may be able to feed the scroll directly into the printer.

I imagine that would cost more cash than it costs me to print up stuff here on my own printer and attach it to a scroll sheet, but it would probably look nice. And it would be the way for people who can't get their hands on scroll paper...

A scroll comic would be very cool, and if the infinite canvas is not vertical, you could print it out as one big poster.

That is the way I was thinking. Originally I planed to paste each sheet of paper like this:



Elongate this and you get a scroll that can be read as a scroll or as a poster.

Actually, poster sized comics meant to be displayed on a wall might be another cool idea. They could be any size, since you wouldn't have to worry about it fitting on a shelf.

[losttoy]

This is vary possible ... I don't know what you are intending on the material of the scroll itself, but if you are happy with standard paper stock it is very do-able. The question is if you insist on color it is VERY expensive, while black and white is only kind of expensive. At most Kinko's they will have both color and b&w large format printers. the width is about 24" to 36" wide. The total length of a fresh new roll of paper is about 100 ft (depending on what kind). This ought to give you plenty of space to do this. However, I know at least one printer that will only print 9ft at length at a time. Call up your local Kinko's for pricing and printer specs. (Vince, I believe you are Japan ... just go to http://www.kinkos.com/locations/intl.ph ... ryCode=JPN for one near you ... they are everywhere).

[gazorenzoku]

(Vince, I believe you are Japan ... just go to http://www.kinkos.com/locations/intl.ph ... ryCode=JPN for one near you ... they are everywhere).

That sounds scary....

But, unfortunately, there is no Kinko's within shooting distance of Sapporo. However, I assume that there must be other companies that can do this sort of thing.... One day I will look in to it.

Thanks for the advice!!

vince

[losttoy]

May I make a comment about your format. Your diagram shows a left to right down then back up to left to right down as shown.


The problem with that is you'd be using the scroll as a gimic without using it for it's purpose, one long flowing canvas. With every page you have to pull back up which doesn't flow very well. An suggestion to make it flow as one big piece (although you can still maintain one page at a time) is this:


This to my opinion would seem like a better way to use the scroll format.

[gazorenzoku]

I wasn't able to view the graphics in your post, but I think I understand what you are saying, and agree 100%.

[losttoy]

hmm, odd the images are not apearing for me too even though they showed up when the day I posted it ... how about just using the URL's...

example 1:
http://www.geocities.com/dalosttoy/scroll1.gif

example 2:
http://www.geocities.com/dalosttoy/scroll2.gif

[gazorenzoku]

the URLs didn't seem to work, although one had an ad for lesbian videos....

vince

[losttoy]

ugh ... one last try before I go crazy ... just copy and paste the URLs and don't hit the link.
www.geocities.com/dalosttoy/scroll1.gif
www.geocities.com/dalosttoy/scroll2.gif
<sigh>