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losttoy
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Joined: 02 Apr 2002
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Location: Ann Arbor, MI

PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tim Tylor wrote:
I gather Adobe Photoshop can do computer-generated tapering lines, though I haven't had the chance to try it myself.


In the vector paths of Photoshop you can edit points and curves much like in Illustrator. Once you decide to stroke the path, Photoshop 7 has an option to "appply pressure" which if you are using a seven point size brush (to give an example) it will go from zero points at the start of the line, tepper to seven points in the middle and back to zero points at the end of the line. I use this for all of my art since I want to edit the hell out of my lines before making it any weight. I usualy stroke first at maybe threee or four points for the whole line and thenn 7 with apply pressure to give a more hand illustrated look to it.
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gazorenzoku
Reinvents understanding


Joined: 08 Nov 2001
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Location: Sapporo, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Jun 27, 2004 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wow. that's cool. can you give an example? or maybe i should just look at the art on your site...

I didn't know Photoshop could do stuff like that... embarasing, but I didn't know Photoshop could create vector graphics... I'll have to read up on it.

Well, Illustrator came in the mail, but it is for Windows 2000 and up! And we only have a 98! Someone made a mistake somewhere.... now the slow wheels of "education edition" software have to be set back into motion... maybe in another month or so from now we'll get an Illustrator we can use...

Anyhow, if Photoshop can do that, I might be ok without Illustrator for a while...
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losttoy
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Joined: 02 Apr 2002
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 29, 2004 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An easily seen example of a use of "apply pressure" is at http://www.geocities.com/david_ano/norlin1.html (warning it may take a bit to load all the way)

I use it in all of my work I do now. I try to make it not too noticable like in the Zwol: Nouveau Chemin it was hardly noticable. The thing about this, it is still a raster program. It has vector paths and you can even export the paths into a .eps, but once you stroke the line in photoshop, it is raster art in a layer. If it does not look right you still have the vector path to edit, adjust and redraw it if you want.
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gazorenzoku
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2004 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sounds cool. I am going to try it out later. Whee. Too bad the final line isn't a vector graphic, but it sounds cool anyhow.

So.... I tried to look at your example but I couldn't open it... but I'll just go to your site and check out other stuff...

----

Wait, I was able to access it. Weird. The browswer is being all weird. Anyhow, yeah, I see what you are talking about. Looks like tons of fun! I can't wait to try it out.

Thanks!
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Rochnarand
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Joined: 21 Jun 2001
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2004 4:38 am    Post subject: You can do it! Reply with quote

Vector graphics are all fine and dandy. And they McCracken may use them now, but in the early days I'm almost positive that PPG was inked. And I know that McCracken's school project, "The Whoopass Girls" was inked. I think that part of the trick is that the lines are very thick so it's easier to make them clean.
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gazorenzoku
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2004 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

can that "whoopass girls" be seen on the net somewhere?

those lines are just way to clean to be inked... if I were the one doing the inking, that is!! I love my inking style, but it is not clean. Or, rather, it is, but all the lines are wavy

(here is what I mean: http://www.vince-coleman.com/bastarts/portfolio/samurai_color_04_web.jpg )

though I did notice that in the animation, none of the lines end in points. It is only the static illustrations (comics, posters, calanders, ads, etc.) that have tappering lines. So the animation might be done with felt tip pens or something, in which case, yeah, you could easily get clean, round lines with tools like a compass, etc.

It was the tapered lines on the static illustrations that made me think I was dealing with some sort of brush like thing, which would make it really difficult to do by hand. Then again, the only lines that taper at all are lines in the face and stuff... the mouth, the lines on closed eyes, etc. So theoretically, you could draw the rest of it with markers and get some straight, I mean clean & smooth lines, and then just ink the mouth and stuff in with a brush.
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frogtumor
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 8:24 pm    Post subject: Also try Potrace Reply with quote

Take a look at Potrace or Autotrace, which are vectorizing
programs for converting raster into vector graphics.
They are not recommended if you don't have expirience
with command line software or have the patience to deal with installing them,
in which case you may find Corel Draw more appropriate (i've never used it, but it sounds like it's cabaple of vectorizing).

I personally use Potrace with lots of my inked lineart that i draw.
It analyzes a .bmp and generates a .eps (postscript) which is
then re-rendered as a raster image in photoshop.
The result is much cleaner than the original, and can be rendered
into any size without distortion or noise.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 9:34 pm    Post subject: Just to throw another program on the pile Reply with quote

Macromedia Flash will convert bitmap to vector. You can export/ cut and paste the vector out to another program.

Does a decent job, but, annoyingly, creates fill objects too.
So, if you have a black circle, Flash creates a black outline and a white fill.

But, it does a decent job.
You can set tight or loose curves/ corners and other adjustments.
Then the tweaking begins.

Just FYI
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Tim Mallos
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Joined: 23 Apr 2001
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Location: Brighton, Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 9:35 pm    Post subject: Just to throw another application on the pile... Reply with quote

Macromedia Flash will convert bitmap to vector. You can export/ cut and paste the vector out to another program.

Does a decent job, but, annoyingly, creates fill objects too.
So, if you have a black circle, Flash creates a black outline and a white fill.

But, it does a decent job.
You can set tight or loose curves/ corners and other adjustments.
Then the tweaking begins.

Just FYI
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gazorenzoku
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the info, frogtumor. Hope your medical problem gets worked out soon...

Hi Tim! For a while I went through a phase where I was using Flash to turn bitmaps into vector graphics. It was a lot of fun. I've been focusing on plain old non-computer graphics recently, but I'm startin to get the hankerin to mess around with digital stuff, so I might try it out again.

I developed this really cool technique. I would draw stuff smaller than the finished image (instead of larger). The drawings were done with brush and ink.

Then I would scan in Photoshop, save as a 600 dpi black and white btm file, and "vectorize" it in Flash. I always chose really low curve settings, etc., so the lines were ultra smooth. Then, I would actually enlarge the work in Flash! So the finished drawing was usually enlarged to about 120% of the original.

Check out how it looks:
http://www.vince-coleman.com/og_01.html
(beware! For mature readers only!)

The lines are nice and thick, and creamy. I love them.

With Flash you can get really nice and easy solid colors. Shading is best done by combining flat tones instead of using subtle gradations. So if you are happy with a "Justice League Animated Adventures" look, this is really a cool way to go. Cause, don't forget, you are coloring something in a vector program, which means you don't have to worry about dpi. Which means a color image doesn't take up half of China's computer space. Whatever that means...

*One warning, though: if your original piece has too much detail in it, you can't get a good vector image out of it. Especially if you are working with low settings to assure smoothness.

If anyone is interested in the specifics, let me know.
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gazorenzoku
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Location: Sapporo, Japan

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2005 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan Hernandez wrote:
hey all this may be too late but i wanted to say that you don't need a tablet to create tapered lines, all you need to do is go to window>brush libraries> artistic sample/ then you can use the tapered brushes. i actually created my own brush set similar to those ones to draw the following

http://www.pennydreadfull.net/stupidcrap/bubbles.gif


Still haven't tried this!! I've been busy with tons of other stuff. But maybe this next week I can try it out. Looking forward to it!!

I have yet to draw using Illustrator. I use Flash, which is also a vector based program, but I haven't used Illustrator yet. Any tips for drawing in Illustrator? Is it difficult? Easy? Do you recomend the "pen tool"?
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