Site design

[Greg Stephens]

I've been doing a lot of behind the scenes stuff with my site these days and making some more overt changes. This leads me to wonder, what are your theories on web site design for a webcomic site? What are the priorities? How should it work? What works for you and what doesn't work for you, but might work for somebody else? If you don't have a site, how would you design it if you did?

To throw out some of my opinions, my site has always been very simple from a graphic design standpoint because I have two goals in mind: Keep the bandwidth load to a minimum and make the site available in as many browsers as possible. This means not using any more images than I absolutely have to (the exception being this forum, which I didn't code- only modified a little). I was also reading a lot of Jakob Nielsen at the time of initial design, and a some of that still influences me today (though not as much).

I originally designed the site to be as similar as possible in any browser I could test with, but now I've decided that it's better to sacrifice similarity in favor of accessibility because there are some things that older browsers just can't do which I would like to do since it would make my life much easier. For example, implementing CSS means that this will be the last time (hopefully) that changing the look of my site will mean editing every single page. I should be able to handle that by just editing the CSS file.

Now, this approach means that my site isn't as flashy, colorful or attractive as some I've seen, but it works for me. What works for you? Why did you design your site the way you did or, if you don't have a site, how would you design a site?

[rcar]

For me the site is secondary to the comic. A good site has the comic on the first page. No clicking around to find the comic. Second, make everything simple and easy to find. I hate sites that look great, but you can't find anything. I used to change my site a lot, but now I don't worry too much about it. People come back for the comic, not the site.

What I try to do is look at my site as if I were a visitor. How easy is it for for people to understand what you are offering and how easy is it to find. Keep the clicking down. The fewer clicks to find something the better. If I have to click, then click, then click and still find what I want, I leave the site.

My site rule: keep it simple.

[rcar]

that was me above: RCAR. I'm not logging in for some reason.

Randy Carboni

www.mermbut.com

Greg edits:Odd. I've fixed that.

[Greg Stephens]

Actually I forgot but, yeah, that was another of my primary design criteria- to have the comic as close to the top of the page as possible. Granted, it could be closer if I put it at the absolute tip-top of the page, but I wanted a little logo and some navigation up there, too.

[Alexander D.]

For example, implementing CSS means that this will be the last time (hopefully) that changing the look of my site will mean editing every single page. I should be able to handle that by just editing the CSS file.

CSS is great for this, but there are other ways to accomplish this without limiting accessibility. I've been using Dreamweaver 4.0 for all my site designing lately, and am absolutely in love with the automatic update feature. With this tool, you edit one template file, and Dreamweaver automatically updates every html file linked to that template. Which means you can easily change the complete look of your site by adjusting one file. But since the actually output is pure html, there are no browser compatibility issues.

[Jack Masters]

My new comic, Temporalectopia, has nothing on its page except the comic itself. In part, I was just to tired at the time I put it up to stick in a bunch of info and dingbats and such, and in another part I don't really want to look at that stuff anyway.

[Alexander D.]

Two things that I think are very important -- make sure your archive includes the date of the comic, and make sure the individual comic pages are linkable. More than once, I've been reading an old thread where a particular strip gets mentioned, so I go to the site to read the strip, only to discover the strips don't have dates on them, so I can't find the one I need. Drives me nuts.

As for keeping the individual strips linkable, this isn't just for posting in threads, and whatnot. This is for when someone wants to read your archives, but doesn't want to do it all in one sitting. For instance, I've been reading Dan Harlowe's Give Me Back My God. His site is organized with a pulldown menu that opens the strips up in a seperate frame that isn't linkable. Problem is, last time I left off was a couple of weeks ago, and for the life of me, I can't remember what strip I was up to. So I haven't gone back yet, not because I wasn't enjoying the comic, but because I've been reluctant to invest the time it's going to take to figure out where in his 300+ strip archive I need to be. (No offense meant to Dan Harlowe -- I just needed an example.)

[Greg Stephens]

[Y]ou edit one template file, and Dreamweaver automatically updates every html file linked to that template. Which means you can easily change the complete look of your site by adjusting one file. But since the actually output is pure html, there are no browser compatibility issues.

Well, you may edit one file, but that still means that Dreamweaver (never used it myself, but heard good things about it) has to update every single page. Does it provide the facility to upload the pages for you? If so, then OK, but if not, then you've got to upload all your pages manually as well. With CSS, the pages remain the same, while you only edit and only upload one file. And, though not as much these days, there are many compatibility issues with HTML itself which cause a page to render differently in different browsers.

And there are even more alternatives- Content Management Systems spring to mind, where the layout is a template (much like your Dreamweaver example, but in real time rather than as static files) and all the content is stored in a database or other filesystem. This forum runs very much on that principle.

[M]ake sure your archive includes the date of the comic, and make sure the individual comic pages are linkable.

I agree with you 100% on this one. For any comic that updates on a regular schedule, this is almost a must. For similar reasons, I frown on frames because that makes it much more difficult to link to any framed page without losing whatever valuable information may be in the surrounding frame.

[rcar]

Jack has taken my rule of "keep it simple" to heart. Doesn't get any more simple than that.

[catgarza]

if i had a site, i'd design it like this:

www.superbad.com

[Greg Stephens]

Wow- your site sure has changed.

[gazorenzoku]

I don't too much care for the newest comic being put on the top page. I like to see a fun top page with graphic links (I don't mean graphic as in nudity or violence, but as in not text) to comics. My page is kind of like this, but not as cool as it could be yet.

I also think that dates are not as important in the archives as the order. In my opinion, they should be placed in order and not on a calandar or anything like that. Just a simple list, made up of graphics if possible.

I imagine that the first page of the site is like a cover to the comic (though in a shape that works with the browser size, of course) and a table of contents all in one. But, above all, it has to be CLEAR and easy to understand (which is what most people are saying, it seems)

When I get some time I will either redesign my site to meet the criteria above or find a site that does so I can provide a visual example....

[Alexander D.]

Well, you may edit one file, but that still means that Dreamweaver (never used it myself, but heard good things about it) has to update every single page. Does it provide the facility to upload the pages for you?

Actually, it does. It comes with a great file mover program that works both automatically and manually, depending on how you set it up. The automatic setting will update every page you've altered since your last update with one click. I can't argue how well it works, since I actually prefer manual updating, but I'd bet it works pretty well. The manual file mover is absolutely the best I've ever used. Moving multiple files at once is no problem, and it will even automatically generate folders to maintain your site structure if you move whole folders at a time. No other FTP program I've ever used was able to do this.

With CSS, the pages remain the same, while you only edit and only upload one file.

Definite point in favor of CSS. Please don't misunderstand me -- I'm not arguing against using CSS. I happen to like it very much. I've used it a little bit in the past, and hope to learn more about it for future projects. And I think you're right that enough time has passed that it's reasonably safe to start using it without worring about browser compatibility. I was just trying to offer another solution that I think happens to be pretty good. Especially since some people are less convinced that CSS is safe to use, and still more people don't want to take the time to learn how to write it. Personally, I don't mind updating the pages manually, so the main advantage here either way is just not having to do the actual changes to every page in the site, so either solution looks good to me.

And, though not as much these days, there are many compatibility issues with HTML itself which cause a page to render differently in different browsers.

Actually, I'm having a real problem with this. My comic isn't a single image like most people's -- each frame is a seperate image. The problem I'm having is that IE and Netscape scroll the images differently. IE allows for a horizontal scroll (which is what I wanted), while Netscape forces the images into a vertical scroll, which I find disruptive to the timing of the comic. If anyone has any thoughts on why this happens and what I might be able to do about it, it'd be appreciated.

And there are even more alternatives- Content Management Systems spring to mind, where the layout is a template (much like your Dreamweaver example, but in real time rather than as static files) and all the content is stored in a database or other filesystem. This forum runs very much on that principle.

If you have the knowledge and resources to run a site this way, that's great, but it's probably a bit advanced for most people's needs. This sort of thing is really geared more toward sites where the content is a lot more dynamic than a once a day comic update. Again, this forum is a good example.