The Importance of Editing

[danharlow]

Today I did something with my comic strip that I wish I had done long ago. I edited it down.

For nearly a year I published every single day and often (83 times to be exact) I published strips that I really could have done without. Not that I thought what I had was no good but it didn't fit in with the overall theme of what I was hoping to achieve with my strip. I will admit that I was going for quantity as well because, really, I wanted to get noticed and I was hoping that by having alot of work people would think more of my strip. In hindsight I feel that was cheating.

How does everyone else feel about the editing of their own work? Do all of you write and draw more than you publish? I've seen very good comics publish some stuff once and awile that just seems like not alot of effort was put into that particular strip (I'll call it filler). I know we can't all be comic geniuses all the time, but how do you balance between publishing something on time for your strip while keeping the quality at a level you are always pleased with?

[losttoy]

well ... I am starting to edit. When getting started (this is my fourth month) an important goal for me was to just putting something up. Some of my early stuff is kind of blah. As time is going on I still have pressures to put something up but still takes time for the quality. In the last three months I have done 25 comic strips. I have decided currently to stop posting on my site and I wrote a note on the index. A: I'm going to redo the design and format to my web site (seperate the editorial cartoons from the gag comic strips), B: I'm going to draw a bunch of comics before posting to ensure quality and if I get behind I won't worry too much. During this time I plan to throw out a bunch of the blah strips in my archive. I am also being to think about getting somebody to look over my comic before I post it.

Well, that is my experience so far as a new web cartoonist.

[Alexander D.]

Having yet to run an actual strip, I can't speak to this from the point of view you're asking it from. However, I have gotten the impression that, in general, readers would rather find something, even if it's not your best work, rather than a frustrating "check back tomorrow." I know I feel this way -- so long as the piece still has some merit, I don't mind a lesser work. But I feel cheated if there's nothing there at all.

[Guest]

Two words: Time management.

Of course, this means you draw and write during breakfast, lunch, dinner, while out on social occasions, at work, at play, etc. Either that or you constantly think about writing or drawing during those times. Could get annoying to any present company, but to hell with them! You're doing a webcomic. For free. Um... yeah...

I try to write material several weeks in advance that way I can add or subtract (EDIT!) when necessary, which is a LOT.

[lcachola]

Two words: Time management.

Of course, this means you draw and write during breakfast, lunch, dinner, while out on social occasions, at work, at play, etc. Either that or you constantly think about writing or drawing during those times. Could get annoying to any present company, but to hell with them! You're doing a webcomic. For free. Um... yeah...

I try to write material several weeks in advance that way I can add or subtract (EDIT!) when necessary, which is a LOT.

Crap. I hate forgetting to login.

[japanimationfist]

If I were to start editing, seriously, I would probably wind up going back and re-writing the entire first chapter of my strip, bt instead I have decided to leave it as is, so I can look back a few months from now, and be even more embarassed than I am now

[losttoy]

Two words: Time management.

If it was only that easy. My wife gets annoyed after a while and wants me to spend time with her. She does support my creative outlet, but misses me when I am at work and then I go home to ignore her while drawing comics. I have trouble doing my comics at work because people will wonder why I am not working. I do sketch every chance I get ... not not nessisarily what I would post on my web-site. (sigh)

But I guess I am taking a break from posting to allow me to catch up on drawing so when I do post again I will have a supply first. That is, if I manage to find time first.

[Guest]

There's another thread in itself! Doing these things requires a great deal of concentrated time at the computer, and that can be rough on a relationship. I have been trying to do most of my drawing once my girlfriend is in bed, but I wind up wiped out the next day.

Time manangement is the key, and if anyone has a key to spare, I could use it

[lcachola]

If I were to start editing, seriously, I would probably wind up going back and re-writing the entire first chapter of my strip, bt instead I have decided to leave it as is, so I can look back a few months from now, and be even more embarassed than I am now

You could always do what I did: when you do the book, re-edit everything. Of course, now I want to re-edit the book...

[danharlow]

You bring up a good point as well - when we look at our older work are we satisified with it or not? For me I like to look at my older stuff to see the progression of what I've done and that's what other people want to see as well. We still like old first and second season Simpsons episodes even though they are pretty crude by the current standard but they still stand the test of time (well, many of them do anyway). Of course the work you do now is going to be better than what you did a year ago, if it isn't then maybe you should consinder spending time doing something else.

As for time management I am in a more unique situation since I do not draw my comics (I can't draw and don't pretend to) so I use photo images which means I spend all my time writing new strips. Right now I'd say in a good month I use 30% max of what I write which is why I've gone to a two day a week schedule. Personally anyone who can go seven days a week and maintain high quality is my hero. I have found though that there is pressure to create more, people are always wanting a new strip and it's easy to fall into the trap of just posting to post.

And that brings up the trouble with the internet. We can post whatever and whenever we want with nobody to answer to. Is this a good thing? Personally I'd like it if I had an editor telling me that "this needs to be changed" or "that needs to go". How does everyone else feel about that? Do you think your work would be better if there was someone who you had to "turn it over to"?

[losttoy]

I have this one comic where I make a joke about "Shelby, the Interactive Clam". I then decided instead of a punchline and being crude, I would write a fake editor's note cencoring the punchline. Although now, I still feel guilty because now the punchline is "fill in the blank" and left in the minds of people more dirtier than I and it much worse. Currently I am reorganizing my archive and I am really thinking about leaving it out. I'm not sure. Since this is the topic of discussion here, what do other people think?

[Alexander D.]

I then decided instead of a punchline and being crude, I would write a fake editor's note cencoring the punchline. Although now, I still feel guilty because now the punchline is "fill in the blank" and left in the minds of people more dirtier than I and it much worse.

There's nothing wrong with this. This is the sort of joke that works on a different level for different sorts of people. Each reader will see the joke as being as dirty as they want it to be. People with dirty minds will see it as very dirty -- and will like that. People without dirty minds will be baffled, and a bit afraid to find out what the joke could possibly be -- but they won't really fill anything in because their mind doesn't really work that way. Either way, this joke really is on the audience -- for people with dirty minds, it's teasing them about their own lewdness. For others, it's teasing them about being too innocent. But nothing in it is really offensive to anyone.

[Alexander D.]

Personally I'd like it if I had an editor telling me that "this needs to be changed" or "that needs to go". How does everyone else feel about that? Do you think your work would be better if there was someone who you had to "turn it over to"?

This is precisely why I don't self-publish anything I write. Without that extra layer of criticism for the work to pass through, I'm just not confident that the work is good enough to publish. If I had the time to do a Web strip (which I almost did, once upon a time), I would make an exception for that, but I'd actually feel sort of guilty about it.

Of course, I'm an editor. So I naturally tend to place a higher value on what an editor does than most writers.

[lcachola]

You bring up a good point as well - when we look at our older work are we satisified with it or not?

I like to think of it as a rough cut because it's so easy to make changes on the Internet. It's something I go back to and revise later and keep coming back to again and again. Once you commit it to print, it's a lot more difficult to make changes but you can come out with a new edition at a later date). I was speaking with a syndicated cartoonist at the San Diego Comic-Con and he went through and edited and changed stuff when he went to book format. As long as you don't think of your work as sacred and untouchable, then I don't see any problems with going back and revising things.

I have found though that there is pressure to create more, people are always wanting a new strip and it's easy to fall into the trap of just posting to post.

I just went 7-days a week myself and am consciously aware of this trap. Let's see how I feel after six months of this....

And that brings up the trouble with the internet. We can post whatever and whenever we want with nobody to answer to. Is this a good thing? Personally I'd like it if I had an editor telling me that "this needs to be changed" or "that needs to go". How does everyone else feel about that? Do you think your work would be better if there was someone who you had to "turn it over to"?

I think reducing to good or bad might be too limiting in its scope. The good part is that it's YOUR vision and if you have the faith and commitment to see it through and are happy with the results, you'll know that 100% of that was yours. However, as you said, the drawback is that it lacks a second pair of eyes that could possibly make it better - thus, it becomes that much more important that you're open to input from everyone whom you can get to read your work.

[gazorenzoku]

my 2 cents:

I would much rather see quality than quantity. Jason Little at Bee Entertainment (www.beecomix.com) does a wonderful updating comic that comes out irregularly, but I read it more faithfully than any regularly updating comic. Why? Because it is really good. The space of time in between each update is sometimes short, sometimes long, but whenever he e-mails me to tell me that there is an update, I immediately go check it out. And it is always good. Every single time. I trust him not to put up anything that is not good, but there are a lot of sites out there that do not inspire that trust. I hate that feeling that you get when you realize that someone just wrote and drew a strip to meet a deadline, especially when it is self imposed!!!

And that is the maddeningly funny part about it: these deadlines are self imposed!! And yet, the sites with the highest hits seem to be the ones with the most regular updates, which usually means lots of low quality work. Ironic...

I imagine that I am in the minority here, but that's my 2 cents...

vince

[Alexander D.]

but whenever he e-mails me to tell me that there is an update, I immediately go check it out.

I think that's the key right there -- he sends out an e-mail update. The main reason that frequent comics get more hits than good comics is simply because people don't check a site regularly if they don't expect new work regularly. If a site is too infrequent with it's work, many people won't check back simply because they've forgotten about it, not because they aren't interested. But the sites that offer e-mail updates go a long way toward fixing this problem. There are plenty of comics I would likely still be reading if only the creators sent out notices when there was new work up.

[gazorenzoku]

I too think that e-mail updates are the key. In fact, because I don't much care for updating stuff if the quality is poor, I would go so far as to say that the e-mail update might be a tool that can boost the standard of online comics to a new level. Especially since most online cartoonists aren't getting paid for what they do, which means that they have to go to work everyday, which means that they don't have the same kind of time that Mike Alred (my personal hero) or other full time comics people have.

It's silly to expect someone who just doesn't have a full work day to think up and draw out a comic should be able to turn out the kind of work in a day that someone like Alred can. And why settle for less quality when you could have more if you just wait for it? What's the rush? It's not like these websites cost you money to look at, after all, so why not think of the wait as an "offering" in place of money? Could you imagine what a Mobius comic would look like if he had to keep up with the pace of a daily updating web site and hold down a day job? Would anyone want such a thing when they could have a beautifully painted Mobius work instead?

There seems to be this kind of work ethic in the realm of comics in general, and online comics specifically, that may or may not be traced back to Dave Sim's "page per day" philosophy. I know that the work ethic attitude is a direct reaction to all the slackers out there, especially those blasted talented slackers that could use their powers for the greater good of the world of entertainment, but somewhere along the way I feel like there might have been a slight alteration of the original train of thought.

The idea should be "a good page per day" if the artist is getting paid for it, and "a good page as often as possible" if the artist is not getting paid. A supliment to that might be: "a good page as often as possible, with an e-mail notice."

Anyhow, I think I might have forgotten to mention it, but I am all in favor of editing, either self editing or getting someone to look at the story. I redrew the first 7 pages of a comic and then redrew the last page again just the other day because it needed to be done. Now, if I were getting paid for it, I might not have been able to do that, but heck, the only payment I get is satifaction from making something I like. Until the cash starts rolling in, that's the way it is going to be.

vince

[losttoy]

I think it is a good idea to have a second set of eyes to look at your comic. Although, a good editor does not say, "this needs to be changed" or "that needs to go" ... but "what can be improved?" or "how can we make this message clearer?" I think the most important thing is for the editor to ask the same questions that a reader might ask (i.e.: "what the heck does that mean?").

The question I ask is ... who wants to be a comic strip editor? Maybe an experienced online comic editor would read my comic before I post it? ... maybe a fellow cartoonist who has experience in trying to express themselves in this medium? A colaboration where artists edit fellow artists' comics sounds like a good idea.